Experience today (first post)

TD_Tim · Joined: 25 Nov 2008 Posts: 7

Hi all,

It's my first post on here so hello to everyone, I have enjoyed visiting this forum for the last year or so.

I've never felt inclined to post before, but had an experience today which I can't get over without seeking advice on whether I could have handled it better.

A bit of background on me, well I work in Surrey as an engineer, and just over 2 years ago took advantage of an offer through work to pay for RoSPA tests for those who drive for work purposes (I don't very often, but hey, it was free, and I thought it might help not to incur any future motoring penaltys, I had a couple previously.) With the help of Roadcraft, a training DVD and the highway code, I achieved a RoSPA silver, which I was pleased with, probably a low silver to be honest as I made a silly mistake in understanding a road sign on the motorway, and the drive wasn't completely smooth.

Since then I have read around the subject of advanced driving a fair bit as I find it quite interesting, but am by no means an expert, but find I'm thinking about my driving a lot more, and not falling into lazy habits too much.

Anyhow, cut to today... I went to the shops a few miles away from home at around 6.30PM, when the rush hour has died down, and on the way back, hoping for a nice free flowing, enjoyable drive, my hopes were dashed..

Driving through a village with a 30mph limit, I see headlights looming behind. A 50mph limit is approaching, followed by country lanes. It would have been easy to get on the power early to please the driver behind and reach 40mph+ before the end of the 30 limit, but I held back, and the headlights got closer. I could now make out the car, it was a BMW 3 series. Closer he got, and as I approached the change of limit, he was no more than 3 car lengths behind. I'm preparing to accelerate now but watching his body language in case he want to overtake. No movement, so, in 4th, I accelerate swiftly up to 50, as traffic is light and visibility/road surface etc. is good (my car is an MG ZS Diesel BTW so decent 4th gear acceleration from 30 is not a problem).

He was left floundering, and I am happily moving along, now in 5th. I slow down for a roundabout, and Mr. 3 series, who had held back for the last 30 seconds or so, now decides to loom large in the rear view again. I am carrying about 15mph as I approach the roundabout, which has limited visibility to the right, and I need to stop, so moderate to firm brakes were needed. Looking behind in the mirror I see Mr. 3 series with his head down, looks strange, I think he dropped his cigarette as he broke suddenly, oops. Hmmm, did my fairly firm braking cause this? Well the alternative would have been to approach the roundabout quite slowly, maybe this would have helped, but maybe it would have annoyed him?

I see a break in the traffic and go around the roundabout, leaving Mr. 3 series behind, and then accelerate swiftly up to the 40 limit, through the country lanes, and about half a mile later he's not back with me again. I'm driving my own drive so not too fussed by this, just slightly pleased he has backed off.

Next roundabout, turn right, accelerate swiftly up to the 40 limit, now approaching a 30 limit, lots going on... narrow bridge ahead, oncoming traffic over the bridge, with a pub junction on the right, and another turning to the left, so I use acceleration sense to bring the speed down, approaching the bridge and speed limit change at 30mph but preparing for about 20-25 to enter the bridge. Then I do an all round mirror check, I see some headlights approaching about 20mph faster than me in my offside mirror. It's Mr. 3 series, he's back....

Now this was going to be a tricky few seconds, knowing he was going to have to do some evasive driving if he wanted to get around me, which looked like his intention, as there was a white van coming over the bridge at ~25mph 50 metres ahead. Should I brake, well I didn't in case he aborted the overtake and tried to dive in behind me.

He got past at about 40mph, and wasn't TOO close to me when he pulled back in, about 10 metres in front, but he came within 5 metres of the van coming the other way.

Mr. metallic blue Y-reg. 3 series then carried on at around 45 in the 30 zone, until he met the next car in front, and then hung on to that car's rear bumper until he got past.

Well that's my story, hope nobody nodded off. What could I have done differently?..., well perhaps pandered to his bullying tactics and driven faster, and eroded my safety margins, but then I would potentially become the meat in a 3 car sandwich if cars in front had to brake suddenly. I could have indicated, pulled over and let him pass a couple of times, but the way he dropped back in those places prevented me from doing this, and I thought he had given up "the chase" each time.

Any thoughts? I would have loved to have him in front of me earlier, and in better circumstances than the moment he chose as well, but he didn't want to press on when I could have safely let him past and was prepared to do so.

Thanks all,
Tim

ScoobyChris · Joined: 01 May 2006 Posts: 1256 Location: Andover, Hants

It's a tough situation to be in, especially as he was so inconsistent in wanting to get passed. At what point in the journey did he become a problem you wanted to remove? I'm guessing at the first 50mph sign there was an opportunity to encourage him past, but he wasn't really posing any problem and the same seems true of the roundabout. I think the only point where things start to get problematic are at the point where he's overtaking into a closing gap and I think the only thing I would do differently would be looking to be on the brakes to try and maximise that space if I could but it's easy to say that in retrospect when you know the outcome! Wink

Chris

martine · Joined: 17 Oct 2005 Posts: 1442 Location: Bristol, UK

Firstly and most importantly: Welcome Tim Very Happy

(why did it take you so long to post?)

Anyway...I don't think I would have done anything differently...I have considered (and do) pull over to let someone pass if they are becoming a hazard to me. Since he seemed to be backing off and then gaining it's a judgement thing and only you know how it 'felt'.

On the overtake...obviously once he's commited you have the option of braking or at least backing off to assist him getting past safely (or less dangerously!) but again only you know how it would work.

You are obviously a very 'considered' driver and seemed to have it pretty much under control...occassionally advanced driving doesn't mean you can be super-safe in all situations...sometimes things conspire and it's more a case of 'damage limitation'

PS. From your 'biog' am I right in thinking you did your ROSPA without any observed drives?
_________________
Martin - Bristol IAM Group Senior Observer and Secretary.

TD_Tim · Joined: 25 Nov 2008 Posts: 7

Thanks for the replies and welcome. Don't know what took me so long to post, I guess in most cases I couldn't add a lot to what had already been said on here. Will try to get more involved a bit more often Wink

.

Yes I agree with what you both said regarding reducing speed once he was overtaking. In the short time since me realising he was hooning up behind and then when he overtook me, on reflection I did ease of the accelerator a bit, to reduce speed 1 or 2mph.

Chris, yes you're right as soon as he came up behind me aggressively just before the 50 zone and stayed there for a few seconds I wanted rid of him. My progressive driving did nothing to educate him that I was not a dawdler and make him back off. If anything he took umbrage against my swift acceleration and the fight was on in his mind.

If it came to it, during his overtake, I hope I would have locked up the brakes to avoid a collision.

Yes you are right Martine I didn't have any practical tuition before getting the silver award, as it wasn't offered to me, but in all honesty, and hopefully without too much ego, Roadcraft sunk in fairly well, and the systematic route intuitively seemed like a better way to me, and even though I didn't fully appreciate the benefits of some aspects like avoiding BGOL, I practiced them. I also didn't have too much "sparkle" at the time when working to the system - still working on that now, but when it comes, it's a really good feeling - getting the smooth is good enough, but the next level, now if I could drive like that most of the time I would be very satisfied.

Cheers,
Tim

ROG · Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 1148 Location: LEICESTER

Welcome.

Knowing that I had a numpty behind - even if not too close - I tend to ease off early for an approaching hazard - using brake lights but not actually braking - that way I control the approach speed of the numpty - if numpty does not like it - TOUGH.
_________________
ROG
Civilian Advanced Driver
Senior Observer
Leicester Group of Advanced Motorists
UNEMPLOYED LGV instructor

ScoobyChris · Joined: 01 May 2006 Posts: 1256 Location: Andover, Hants

Mr Cholmondeley-Warner · Joined: 22 Jan 2007 Posts: 668 Location: Swindon, Wilts

Tim I think you handled it well under the circumstances. You were looking ahead and planning, and you knew there was a likelihood you would have to take avoiding action. Apart from that, you could have slacked off slightly more, perhaps, to make more space, but hindsight is a wonderful thing!

Perhaps you'd like to come to an ADUK day sometime and reinforce your skills. Well done on getting RoSPA silver all on your own!
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Nick
North Wilts RoADAR

martine · Joined: 17 Oct 2005 Posts: 1442 Location: Bristol, UK

ROG · Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 1148 Location: LEICESTER

jbsportstech · Joined: 19 Aug 2008 Posts: 344 Location: Somerset

Had it this morning and gues what make and model car it was :::: the tailgaters car of choice yes the ...BMW.... 3 Series for people with no imagination and just like the badge.

I just give myself lots of space and time infront to react slowly to any hazard always get the indicator on in good time and bring on the brake lights early to show I am going into hazard. In extreme sitautions where the driver is very dangerous pull over but it sounds like this was your usaul tailgater who doesnt think about driving concetrate etc and is accident waiting to happen.
_________________
Regards James

Member of Southwest RoADAR

www.fordstownersclub.co.uk

To the average driver 'safe' is not having accidents. To an advanced driver 'safe' is not being vunerable to an accident.

chriskay · Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 427 Location: Shrewsbury

Hi, Tim; in similar circumstances in the past, when I've wanted rid of a follower, I've done an extra circuit of a roundabout.

Cheers, Chris.

jbsportstech · Joined: 19 Aug 2008 Posts: 344 Location: Somerset

TD_Tim · Joined: 25 Nov 2008 Posts: 7

Lots of fine posts since I went to bed last night. Thanks for your input everyone.

Further to the input from Rog and Chris, yes it can be a fine balance, and most of the time backing off slightly seems to put me in more control, but can sometimes agitate the following driver into doing something stupid.

Martine and MR. C-W, thanks for the complement on getting the Silver award, if I'm still in the current job when it's time to renew I'll be aiming for gold this time. If not, I'll probably join a group with an aim of going for Gold, and keeping the RoSPA membership. I'll read up on the open days etc. available some time as well. As for achieving even more qualifications, well maybe when time and funds permit, I wouldn't rule it out.

Cheers,
Tim

waremark · Joined: 15 Apr 2006 Posts: 838

Tim, congratulations - you drive with a very high level of awareness and intelligence. Having got so far without coaching, you are obviously a strong candidate for Gold.

The guy you tangled with is obviously due a big accident quite soon. Let's hope it is only he who suffers.

MGF · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 921 Location: Warwickshire

Then again let's hope no-one suffers. Rolling Eyes